The Search for Proof
Resolving citation conflicts
"Poingdestre-Poindexter A Norman Family" by John Poindexter Landers
John Landers (May 9, 1931 - April 4, 2011)
NOTE: A summary of this
page was published in the PDA Newsletter, October 2004.
The book "Poingdestre-Poindexter,
A Norman Family" (also called "the Red Book") has become the primary
source for many descendants research into their connection to the immigrant
George Poindexter. However, the author, John Poindexter LAnders, failed
to provide sources for the lineage model presented in his book. So we
have to ask the question of what sources led him to this lineage of
the first few generations in America.
The Early Poindexters in America
Research Committee (EPARC) is asking this and other questions and attempting
to find the answers. If you have information, sources, that answer
the questions, do contact us. The questions and our contact info are
on the EPARC's home page. Also
see our Suggested Reading page.
for John Lander's Research Notes:
The ad hoc Search Committee:
- Priscilla Poindexter (daughter of Robert Downs Poindexter, publisher
of the Red Book.
- Gayle Abbott (a 2nd cousin
to John Landers)
- Ed Poindexter, long time
chair and chief researcher of EPARC
- Jamie Poindexter, PDA President
- Others are welcome to join
in the search!
What we know:
- Priscilla Poindexter:
- Several months ago
(Spring 2004), looked around a bit for clues in Shreveport, Louisiana
where her father had a company office. Nothing turned up.
- Aunt has many copies
of the red book (Poingdestre-Poindexter, A Norman Family) in
a closet. She has since retrieved several copies
and put them
up for sale. The aunt doesn't have the research notes.
- Through email discussion
between Priscilla, Ed and I, we thought maybe his notes could
be in either coastal Louisiana or coastal
in a college library filed with a MA or PhD thesis.
Jamie did an online search of the University of Texas in Houston,
but didn't unearth any new clews.
We might also want to look at Roman Catholic Church
libraries, as John was
probably a priest.
- From Gayle:
- Gayle last met John when Gayle was 4.
- Gayle's father is John's cousin.
- Last known address
for John: 116 Camargo, San Antonio, TX 78210. Jamie looked this
up on MapQuest. It is just several blocks South
of the Alamo and the hotel where
PDA reunion was held
in 1996. If
John was still living in S.A. that year,
we were all so very close.
- Gayle has a note that John spent a lot of time in London.
- John was a priest and spent time in The Vatican in the 70s.
- John liked showing people around the town in San Antonio, as
long as he didn't have to drive. Sounds like a sociable
- John was curator of
the White Museum in San Antonio. (Probably the Witte
Museum ). Jamie emailed the museum but got no response.
- John has a cousin,
Jean Fischer, who might know how to get in touch with John. (NOTE:
all of Texas.
- Gayle has some genealogy on John's family, and
a boatload on the rest of Gayle's family. Could
are looking for reside
one of Gayle's relatives?
- John's parents were John Henry Landers and
- Ed Poindexter
- Wrote to John several years
ago but never got an answer.
- The Dallas Library had a manuscript by John Landers in 1986 on
our immigrant George Poindexter.
- A report by the PDA's Early Poindexters in America Research Committee
in January 1992 says: "William R. Poindexter has told us of
the possible death of John Poindexter Landers, author of the major
published treatise on the Poindexters". Today we do not have
record of which William R. Poindexter this is or his source.
- Jamie Poindexter:
- The PDA gedcom
database has John's lineage on the PDA web site.
It shows he descends from George 1 (immigrant adult) through his
son Thomas 2 and his son John 3. Its John's brother 3 that we have
a big question on because the red book does not give the record
or sources that say Thomas 3 is the son of Thomas 2. Yet he has
drawn in his own lineage thru John, so he must have had some source
for that information. Its possible whatever records he found that
show John 3 as son of Thomas 2 might also tell us if Thomas 3 was
John's brother and son of Thomas 2.
Where we need to look next:
- The downtown Dallas public
library. Ed reported: A truly fine genealogy collection. I spent
a day there in 1986, and examined his notes--actually, in the form
manuscript on George-1 Poindexter. They contain a different model
than in the red book; I don't recall whether dated earlier or later
book. And needless to say, no discussion in the manuscript or the
book regarding the difference between his models.
- We need to obtain a
copy of this manuscript, looking for Dallas area volunteer.
- San Antonio, where John
Landers lived much of his life.
Societe Jeriaise library
on the Isle of Jersey
Review the materials collected
by EPARC as reported.
- We need someone to look
into collections in university, college, catholic libraries, etc.
Also someone to
go and talk with the Witte Museum.
- We need someone to look
for obituaries in the late 1970s-80s for John Landers.
- 12 NOV 2004: As a result of the above being published in the October
PDA Newsletter, Dorothy Knox Brown call me (Jamie) and stated that
her reserach, as well as that of Meg Cohen, were all done at about
the same time as John Landers'. Their research of Virginia resources
support Landers' conclusions which puts Thomas 2 as the son of George
2 and grandson of George 1. Her health prevented her from reproducing
the sources that she made her conclusions from. She referred me to
the Swem Library at William and Mary College as the place where she
found her sources.
- 12 FEB 2009: Ed reported that he called Dorothy later--about 2006--and this time, she was VERY FIRM that she had NEVER found any significant evidence which supported Landers!!!! Again, she was unable to cite any specific evidence, or source, or where she found the necessary ideas or info.